30th October 2013
BHAGAVAD BRAHMAN BARBAROCRACY
1. Without ado we present reason for this post : to confront a derivation of the Vaisnava sect (an American / Jewish / Gaudiya cult first registered (1968) in New York as ISKCON), who have openly declared intent to engender, publicize and enforce a chimera / diktat of its founder, a Bengali (late) named- A. C Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada (acBSp.) The "Varnasrama" caste system.... now a recognized Brahmanical (caste) distortion of truth for profit and control ... is promoted within the cult as the founder's 'work left undone.' It is endorsed with hubris despite "Untouchability" being declared inhumane, barbaric, and outlawed by the Indian Constitution.... and in face of rising protest by young educated Indians against sexist and racial segregation the system underpins.
2. Albeit acBSp (in his quest for world donors) presented a revised caste doctrine awarding ANYONE (who submits to and serves his organization) a "Vaisnava superior to Brahmin" status, the facts, historically and within his cult, betray the same ingrained religio / Mafioso stand over tactics suffered for centuries by millions of Indians : inhumanity now legislated intolerable and felonious. Furthermore, the complex protocols evolved through centuries of maintaining an imposed religio-controlled caste system, leaves no room for the ambitions of foreign hot-dog converts. A fact that eludes the Hare Krishna cult even after forty-five years of bad spicing, Hindu aping, and evangelical cymbal clanging. Supporters... a few. Integration... NEVER! So, like a barking dog without bite, the Hare Krishna cult points to an uncontested fallacy as fact (yet another idiotic belief imbibed from its alley educated founder) i.e., the word "Hindu" was a recent invention vis-a-vis 'Vaisnavism" is older ergo superior. In truth, the word Hindu goes so far back * it challenges glottochronology. Conversely, the word "Vaisnavism" cannot be found anywhere in antiquity. It is the new kid on the block.... a cheated morphing of the word "Vishnuism." What to speak of the Am / Jew word- "ISKCON" ? ... Registered 1968 in New York, with an "Open House" policy:- "Chaitanya is god. He said we can all be guru-gods. No Indian passport required. Just throw your banana in our fire and start collecting disciples and donations.... We'll talk percentages later."
Listen to this poppycock from Iskcon guru, Hrdyananda "Shorty" Gaswami: " I will argue below that in early Vaisnava, and indeed Vedic, religious discourse and polemics, the term and concept 'Hindu' is unknown. Later, in contact with the Muslim rulers of India, Vaisnavas become 'Hindu' for the outsider ...[...]... For our purpose here, I shall focus on a few of the most distinguished spokespersons of both neo-Hinduism and surviving traditional Hinduism, and show how in each case their idiosyncratic notions of a monolithic Hinduism create significant religious problems for the Vaisnava community, which is, after all, supposed to be a majority component of Hinduism. This will lead directly to consideration of my question, 'For whom does Hinduism speak?' and more specifically to the question, 'Can Hinduism speak for Vaisnavas?'
3. BIF: Shorty. Your supposition that the Vaisnava community is a majority component of Hinduism is exactly that... a supposition. It may sound great to the Gungadin galère, but no one, not even cultified zygote Hindus, will suck that egg. To answer your question- "Can Hinduism speak for Vaisnavas?" the answer is an emphatic NO! The cult's belief system (Bopadev's "Bhagavat Purana" ... witches, warlocks and hobgoblins.. plus) was a dud, even back when education was believe-it-or-hell. That puranic melon was re-squeezed by ISKCON in the west. It was plagiarized by acBSp, re-printed by his cult press as "Srimad Bhagavatam" and sold aggressively on the street (no major publishing house or retail outlet would touch it). Current book sale figures (not fudged) indicate the hare krishna book business is going bust.... a novelty no longer. Your local dumpster will confirm it. So cult collections are now centered on food sales ... "prasadam distribution" .... back to where it started... a "kitchen religion."
4. Gaudiya cultism (Vaisnavism) met with little or no acceptance in its heyday. Albeit the cult receives handouts from sentimental Hindus today, its plastic fantastic fundamentalism is doomed in an India under revision and... in a progressive world. Shorty Gaswami (who added the 11th canto to the cult's SriMAD Bhagavatam) may have difficulty accepting the truth at his home in Beverly Hills, but that's how it is.
5. We fully understand the resistance to fait accompli BIF assertions may mount. Notwithstanding, Truth is Truth, even when presented by a minority of one. So we key this post to show why East is East and West is West and never the twain shall theistically meet..... regardless of whether the West thinks it knows best. Additionally, we accentuate the progressive demise of antediluvian religious status quo and rigmarole by presenting views and news of a modern India.... A red flag alert to Am / Jew megalomaniacs applying outdated Brahmanical sacerdotal ism in quest to conquer, re-segregate and subjugate.
6. In canvassing its product the ISKCON cult sugarcoats ads in salvific familial spiritualism..... quoting the Bhagavad Gita when defining its vision of equality: "The humble sages, by virtue of true knowledge, see with equal vision a learned and gentle brahmana, a cow, an elephant, a dog and a dog eater [outcast]." (Bg aii- 5.18.) It is only when excavating archived cult absolutism does one confront humble sages using hybrid supremacist jargon that is anything but humble. Words such as mayavadi- karmi - kanishta - asura - boghi - meleccha - aparadhi -muddha- grehamedhi- yavana- chandala, is ISKCON (Hare Krishna) Gaudiya Vaisnava cult crafted abuse, defining those who do not conform or convert....the others. The identical mind-set of Brahmana (priests), who created an 'us and them' racial segregation that drove millions of Hindus to find sanctuary in alternative isms. Eighty-five percent of Muslims, resident in India, are converted Hindus. Christians, Buddhists, Sikhs and every other ism has profited from Brahmana sacerdotal racism. Even after conversion (as our linked video below will show) Indians found themselves (and to this day) trapped in Jati / Dalit=Harijan segregation imposed by free-fed Brahmana fundamentalists.... in cohorts with local constabulary and in contravention of Constitutional Law.
7. Currently the issue is under hammer... being dealt with forcefully by India's young academics and humanitarians. Yet outlawed "Untouchability" continues unabating in areas of provincial Punjab, Rajasthan, Gujarat, Bihar, Bengal and all the way down to Tamil Naidu. Sadogue Brahmanas enjoy, labor-free, the exploits granted by interpolated scriptures which provide them birthright occupation and dominance as god's intermediaries among lesser humans (an open door to freeloaders like the Am/Jew ISKCON cult.) Readers will discover that even those who risked escape to isms with beliefs directly opposed to Brahminical racial inequality, found themselves trapped by the old enemy. Here are the names of a few "lesser humans" found also in Indian based Sikhism, Christianity and Mohammadism: Bhanji, Parayas, Chakliars, Pulayans, Madigas, Chamaras, Malas, Musharinis, Valmikis, Mazhabis, Ravidasiyas, Ramagarhias, Doms, Bakos, Sambhuva, Wankaras, Shanvas, Vagharis, Julaha, Pamadiyas, Mansuris, Syeds, Dhuniyas. Together they are referred to as Harijans, or Dalits, or Untouchables, or Lower Caste.
8. Indian Brahmins (as opposed to Brahamana priests,) emerged as India's nobility after Kshatriya rulers (Rajas) were subjected or placed on privy purses by foreign occupiers. Not to be confused with Brahmana priests, this born-to-elitism class of Indians, who represent India's culture and academia, are now left with the task of reviewing and retelling Indian history.... twisted into spiritual fairytales (ten headed demons, stupid parables, analogies and absurdum) by a self-defined 'uppercaste' gone dictatorial and really quite mad. As such, change is inevitable.. magical thinking to practical conclusion. There is no place for caveman cults and buffalo brainetics in Bharat. In an attempt to rule the world by promoting dino Brahaman dictum, ISKCON is challenging a Nation working intellectually to free itself from a swag of swindling freeloaders. No matter how deceptively the copy-cat cult hides foreign-ness and agenda, it is only a matter of time before we hear the roar ....Yankee Yahoudi ghar jao!
Please watch this video below to understand why foreign ISKCON is treading on quicksand. It is a I hr. 50 min. doc. titled- "India Untouched" by a group called "India Awakening." The video will give watchers an understanding as to why religious barbarocracy has no further role to play in India.... or.... the world.
9. So what, if not god ordained, is the caste system? From evidence based in commonsense, human dignity, and revealed history (not dictate,) god had nothing to do with it. The caste system was not a system at all but a definition of class, i.e., nobility, gentry, clergy / educators, peasants. The 'caste system' per se was never absolute during much of India's history. Historical (and now genetic) evidence points to a relatively recent conversion of the word 'class' to 'caste.' The Sanskrit word varna, now understood to mean caste, was literally translated as 'color.' Rare mention of the word 'varna' is made in the Rigveda (1700-1100 BCE.) From studies of that earliest of Indian tomes it becomes clear that social mobility was not restricted by caste encapsulated endogamy. Even after the acceptance of varna as defined caste, Indian history never supported the 'godly distinction' as revealed in Brahmanical (interpolated?) scriptures. For example, Raja Chandra Gupta and his Gupta Dynasty (320 - 550 CE) were Vaishya (traders) not Kshatriya (nobility.) Several Indian rulers were not from the administrative Kshatriya 'caste.' The Madurai Nayaks (1150 - 1739) were Balijas (traders.) It was only when oppressed during the six centuries of Moghul rule (1150- 1750 CE,) when Indian nobility (kshatriyas) could no longer cater to demands of fattened Brahmanas, that the caste system took shape, i.e., Brahmanical 'holy puranas' took prominence threatening the 'lower caste' with hell and damnation. All varnas (a translation that moved from 'color' to 'class' to 'caste') were instructed by "god's puranic litterature" to bank-roll his temples and elite chosen ...the Brahmana (priestly) caste... who were supreme and supremely intellectual except for one glaring fact... modern research and discovery proves them village idiots who lied and twisted India's history, her heroes, her beliefs, and the humanitarian sentiments of her ancient peoples. Now we have a foreign element (ISKCON) riding the Brahmana broomstick from door to door and NGO to NGO claiming they are 'Vaisnavas superior to Brahmanas' and rightful collectors of god donations and slaves.
10. Yet again we present the hard-hitting revelations of the great investigator and holy scribe... Shri Maharishi Dayanand Saraswati, whose crucial and timely revelations frame the outcaste and in-caste of Brahmanical hagiocracy:
"Thus when the laity became bereft of knowledge, the popes who had read a little of the ritual became haughty, they combined together and declared before the kings and others in authority that it was unlawful to punish a Braahman or a Sadhu, and such texts declared "let no Braahman be killed". Braahman and Sadhu, was applied to themselves by the popes. They also wrote books containing false statements whose authorship they attributed to the great sages and seers of the past in order to stamp them with authority.
These books they passed off as the writings of the great Vedic seers and read them out to the people. Thus under the cover of these great names they succeeded in getting themselves out of reach of the Law and did whatever they liked, in other words, they have framed such strict laws that no one durst sit or stand, eat or drink, come or go, sleep or wake without their permission.
They instilled into the minds of the rulers that these so-called Braahmans and Sadhus, who were really popes, might do whatever they liked. They should never be punished. The rulers should not even ever think of punishing them. When the people became so ignorant, the popes did and made others do whatever they wished." (Shri Maharishi Dayanand Saraswati, 1824-83).
11. To key out such accusations without at least some proof would be unjust. So let us take a short sharp journey into the Brahmanical principles of prejudice according to the "Laws of Manu." However, and before doing so, we emphatically state, and our readers will agree at a glance... the "Manusmriti" (also known as Manava-Dharamasastra) could not possibly be written, in its entirety, by any sage or representative of supreme intelligence. Realistically, if not interpolated by Brahmanas to assert their superiority, then Manu (the progenitor of mankind) is no son of the Creator (as designated) but the father of racial segregation. How such a grotesquely interpolated literature is not banned, but instead, permitted to circulate as scripture, is unbelievable.
In what the author has termed a 'rudimentary attempt,' a fairly thorough blogging of the ISKCON founder's usage of the Manusmriti, along with his usual misinterpretations to promote himself god-by-proxy, can be read here:
12. In researching the higher caste, or those claiming to be closest to god (according to Brahmanical interpretation,) we arrive at the creation of man:
Law of Manu (LoM)- Ch 1, v-51: "From his mouth god created the Brahman (priest.) From his arms he created the Ksatriyas (rulers.) From his thighs the Vaishyas (commoners / traiders.) From his feet the Shudra."
13. The above verse is exercised by Brahmanas to elevate their 'caste' to spiritual transceivership, i.e., whatever they say (mouth of god) was directly spoken by god... either in person or via a guru, both receptors being necessarily born Brahmanas. Whereas ISKCON (Hare Krishna) has removed claim to caste by birthright, one must be a member / initiate within the cult to join the elite spiritual relay team- brahmana / vaisnava / sannyasi / guru. Otherwise the mendacity that god speaks to them directly, remains cast in caste:- Prabhupada : "Everyday, when I sit down here to write these books Krishna personally comes and dictates every word."
LoM- Ch 1, v-91: "The Lord assigned only one activity to a servant : serving the other classes without resentment."
14. Without going into degrees of subservience, awards and rewards (or lack thereof,) when pointing at this "god-designed" slavery, we must remember....the other "classes"... Kshatriyas and Vaisayas, were also instructed "by god" to make percentage donations to "his" Brahmanas... that exclusive caste who scalp tickets to heaven. The result from collecting and hoarding, made temples, even today, among the wealthiest tax-free institutions on the Indian subcontinent.
"Those poor simple Rajas were easily taken in by these popes (Brahmanas.) They believed in all that they said and, therefore, did not resist the invader. Many popes, who were astrologers, said that that was not an auspicious time for them to fight, because one said it was the 8th moon while the other said that the Yoginee star would face them (when they go to fight) and so on, they were altogether misled by the popes (and therefore they did nothing to defend themselves). When they were surrounded on all sides by the barbarians, they tried to escape from their miserable plight. Hundreds of popish priests and their dupes fell into the hands of the enemies. Their priests with folded hands implored the Mohammedans to spare their temple and the idol, and offered to pay Rs. 30,000,000 as ransom but the Mohammedans answered that they were not idol-worshippers but idol-breakers and off they went and began to demolish the temple.
When the roof fell, and he magnetic rocks were shifted, down fell the idol which, when broken, was found to contain Rs. 180,000,000 worth of diamonds. When the popish priests were flogged, they began to weep. They were told to point out where the treasury was. Through fear of punishment, they revealed everything. Thereupon the Mohammedans, having looted the treasury and thrashed the priests, made slaves of them as well as of their dupes.
They made them grind corn, cut grass and carry urine and faeces but gave them nothing but parched grain to eat. Oh! Why did these people ruin themselves by the worship of stones? Why did they not worship the Almighty God whereby they could have put the barbarians, to rout and gained victory over them? Had they worshipped heroes and brave men in place of all those idols, what a protection they would have afforded!
The priests worshipped those stones so devoutly and yet not one of them shifted from its place, fell upon the head of one of the invaders and broke it. Had they served a single brave man as they did the idols, he would have done his best to protect those who had served him and to destroy their enemies. (Shri Maharishi Dayanand Saraswati, 1824-83).
15. The British were astounded by the opulence of the "priestly" class and their families. Even the jet-set Brahmin, born-to-wealth, dynasties of today, owe their inherited fortunes to the interpolated Manusmriti and its enforcers. Yet, today's Indians, and expressly the modern educated Brahmin, is redeeming and retelling Indian history by amending the convolutions of rock-age ragabash. (One such Brahmini (Yes, a woman!... and UCLA graduate !!) is working on research that will expose and re-write cult-distorted history.) For Hare Krishna followers who still believe their founder- "You will get Government," that prediction has got to be the biggest dumbass nonsense in circulation. But then again, Hare Krishna believe in twelve mile tall witches, eighty-eight mile high mountains, etc., etc.,... beliefs limited only to dreams, schemes and imagination of guru godmen who claim "... Krishna personally comes... and says... the chips were too salty... Giant eagle eggs are falling through space."
LoM- Ch 3, v-239: "Neither a "fierce" Untouchable, nor a pig, a cock, a dog, a mensurating woman, or an impotent man should be watching the priest (Brahmana) dine."
16. Truly, if Manu (the father of mankind) fathered humans he labeled 'Untouchable,' and then used that disparagement of his own issue to further denigrate elderly men and menstruating women; associating all mothers, wives, sisters, daughters, nieces, womenfolk and elderly with pigs and dogs... it's time Brahmanism faced its bathmism and Manu's children found foster fathers. If that's not enough, have a read of this:
LoM- Ch 2, v-281: " If a man of the inferior cast tries to sit down on the same seat as a superior caste, he should be branded on the hip and banished, or have his buttocks cut off."
17. Is this really a god related exercise? Here are a few more Brahmana 'transcieved' edicts by which gazillions of poor Indians lived and died without question... and what the Am / Jew ISKCON cult wants to make law, yet again:
LoM- Ch 2, v-135: "A ten year old priest (Brahmana) and a hundred year old ruler should be regarded as father and son, and of the two of them the priest is the father."
LoM- Ch 10, v-129: "A servant should not amass wealth even if he has the ability. For a servant who has amassed wealth annoys Brahamanas (priests).
LoM- Ch 2, v-31: "The name of a priest (Brahmana) shoud have a word for auspiciousness of a ruler (Kshatriya) a word for strength, of a commoner (Vaishya) prosperity and the name of a servant should breed disgust."
LoM- Ch 3 v 12/16: "A woman of the same class is recommended to twice born (Brahmanas) for their first marriage.... A man falls when he weds a servant woman."
18. How and why is this tyrannical Brahmana interpolated ... openly dehumanizing... racist ... sexist... manual for segregation and enslavement, still given passage, shelf space (and believership... god help us!) in a modern world? The question becomes more perplexing when literatures, with little or no comparison to this medieval monstrosity, have been banned for infringing on equality and social rights. Books such as- Fallout, Invasion, Seeing Red, Mein Kampf, A World of Difference, Grace's Card, et al, are banned by censors. So why such a marked bias in censorship? Where secular work is genre defined and ruled by political correctness, holy hacks are free to dehumanize targets and hamshackle humanity. Guru-godman-gobble appears on our streets, tax-free, without expurgation, ergo assumed endorsed by law, god and mammon. We must make effort conjointly to free ourselves of this discrimination.
Dalits are Untouchable no longer :
Indian reformer Jyotirao Phule coined the term "Dalit" as a more descriptive and sympathetic term for the untouchables; literally, it means "the crushed people."
Untouchables were barred entirely from temples, and sometimes were not even allowed to set foot on temple grounds.
Untouchables were considered so impure that any contact with them by a caste member would contaminate the other person.
If the shadow of an untouchable touched a Brahmin, he/she would be polluted, so untouchables had to lay face-down at a distance when a Brahmin passed.
Today, the dalits have become a powerful political force in India.... Although they still face discrimination from some quarters, the dalits are untouchable no longer.
19. Now, as stated in paragraph 3 of this article, we present postings: snippets of news and views which spotlight the beginnings of the reformation; the turning away:-
Source: http://www.hindu.com/2008/11/12/stories/2008111251940300.htmProtest against proposed car festival by ISKCON Staff Reporter
Puri: A number of servitors of Jagannath Temple and cultural enthusiasts of Puri on Tuesday took to the street protesting the proposed car festival to be organised by International Society for Krishna Consciousness (ISKCON) in New Delhi on November 23.
They were enraged over untimely celebration of the festival. Servitors burnt effigy of Srila Prabhupad, the founder acharya of ISKCON. Shouting slogans against the organisers, these servitors threatened not to allow the ISKCON followers to Puri.
“Ratha Yatra is usually celebrated in the month of June and July. Since Puri is the real abode of Lord Jagannath, the festival timing should be followed by everyone in and outside the State. So celebrating Ratha Yatra on an unscheduled date is anti-Hindu,” said Priyadarshan Patnaik, national convenor of Jagannath Sena, a local outfit.
The State government and the Jagannath Temple Administration (JTA) should take action against ISKCON authorities and prevent organisers at New Delhi from celebrating the Rath Yatra. Reacting to the development JTA’s public relation officer Laxmidhar Pujapanda said Dibyasingh Dev, scion of Puri Royal family, had requested other State government not to allow celebration of Car Festival on any unscheduled date. Despite the protest last year, ISKCON had celebrated the car festival in New Delhi. It had evoked sharp reactions among servitors and other die-hard followers of Jagannath cult.
However, Bhubaneswar unit of ISKCON had disassociated from the whole controversy. Chief of ISKCON, Bhubaneswar Golak Mohapatra said, “we are not part of the decision taken at New Delhi. We will follow the rituals of Jagannath Temple at Puri. We have even passed a resolution to this effect.”
BENGALURU: Minority schools in Karnataka have said a big no to Chief Minister Sadananda Gowda's proposal to introduce Bhagavad Gita in schools even as opposition Janata Dal Secular and the Congress slammed the Chief Minister for reviving the controversy.
Besides minority schools, the JDS and Congress leaders opposed the move and said they would not allow saffronization of education.
Minority educational institutions had last year gone to the court against the move which forced the government to reconsider the proposal.
But Gowda said his government would hold talks with all sections of society to introduce Gita in school syllabus. "Though many people had raised their voice against the Abhiyan, the overwhelming response shows that the Bhagavad Gita stands as a symbol of communal harmony, and also the most acceptable text," said Gowda.
Surprisingly, Congress leader and Union Minister K Muniyappa, who was present at the function, agreed, saying the introduction of the Hindu scripture would strengthen the students' mindset. However, the Congress distanced itself from Muniyappa, saying there was no dispute about Gita's spiritual context but it should not be forced on schools.
Senior Congress leader V S Ugrappa said the move was nothing short of saffronisation of education.
"Will the government allow the Bible or the Quran to be made compulsory in schools?" he asked.
The High Court, responding to a petition by minority educational institutions, had asked the government not to make teaching of Bhagvad Gita compulsory in schools. The minority institutions said minority rights would be violated if government forced the Gita on them. In fact, Jnanpith award winner Girish Karnad has termed the government support to teach Gita in schools as nothing short of "cultural terrorism".
Minister Kageri Hegde had fuelled the row by saying those who are against teaching of the Gita should leave the country.
BIF: Time, and the fact that this sentimental irrelevance was never implemented, suggests that it was thrown out. And if iskcon thought even for a moment that the Bhagavad Gita As It Is was the version under consideration... they were wrong.
To further illustrate the turning away from dinosaur dictum, we present a link to "'Boloji" and a posting from Kedar Joshi, entitled- "The Satanic Verses of Bhagavad-gita." Read it now before cavemen attack:
KNOTS in a THREAD
Below is an excerpt sent in by a BIF reader. The poster is beginning to see the light, but actually believes there exist villages and farms in Bengal that are Gaudiya Vaisnava. He may be surprised to know that outside Mayapur, hardly anyone cares, even if they know, about the crazy Gaudiyas.
Has the ISKCON Experiment Failed?
ANON: There seems to be a white elephant in the room, Iskcon is a failed experiment, its over, it was over before ACBS left the planet. Gaudiya Vaisnavism was something that was and still is practiced in a home environment in bengali village/farm environment. Once you take it outside of that simple real environment and place it into an institution like Gaudiya Math or Iskcon all sorts of weird things happen.
Quoting numbers of people and buildings is no measurement of spiritual success. Putting it simply not one single ACBS disciple has amounted to much in terms of spiritual impact on the world. They have all either left, been kicked out, murdered or sat in their fathers house and enjoyed the fruits of their fathers labour. For westerners trying to practice GV no matter how hard they try they will always be swimming against the flow, visit a small Vaisnava village and you will see how simple and easy it is for them. Why? because they are brought up in that culture and they have all of the support of the culture.
If Putana was 2X4X8 miles dead, that is 64 cubic miles. The density of water is about 62.4 pounds per square foot, and the human body is about the same density as water (inhale, you float).
A cubic mile of water weighs: 5280 ft x 5280 ft x 5280 ft x 62.4 lbs per square ft = 9,185,152,204,800 lbs, or about 4.5 billion tons. Putana's body would weigh 64 x 4.5 billion tons or about 288 billion tons!!!
Imagine chopping up 288 billion tons of corpse with sickles and then burning it? Hitler could have learned something from these guys.
...and then a "professional hunter" (no less) sees the pink under-sole of a foot, but cannot see the foot attached to a leg... to a hip...to a torso... of a "blue guy" resting against a brown tree, and somehow mistakes it for a deer, pulls an "arrow" and shoots it at ground level... through a hole in the bush?....from around the tree?.... from between sand dunes?....through an anthill? How does a professional hunter mistake the sole of a foot, at ground level, to be a deer?... And why didn't he (an archer) set up a heart shot? Even amateur archers know that deer can run a misplaced arrow interstate.
BIF: The post below is taken from a 'vaisnava' forum. It is disgusting and exceedingly dangerous when understood where these fellows' heads are at : thinking and openly discussing... free of legal intervention or psychological assessment. We give it exposure only to illumine what we have been stressing all along, i.e., iskcon hare krishna, and vaisnavism in general, is a danger to ALL children.... from six years old and up.... and they have a history confirming it.
"The manjaris are NOT pre-adolescents. Sri Dhyanacandra Gosvami writes that one should meditate on the manjari svarupa thus:
kisor gopa-vanita sarvalankara-bhusita prthu-tuga-kuca-dvandva catuhsasti-gunavita "The sadhaka shall contemplate his Vrndvana siddha-deha in this way: She is a kisor-gopi, fully decorated with ornaments, having large raised breasts, and endowed with the sixty-four qualities."
You cannot be "pre-adolescent", as you have written, and also have "large raised breasts" Even if you say the manjari's are 11-13, still Radha and Krsna were 8 years old during Rasa-lila in Srimad Bhagavatam. So how will the manjaris being 11-13 be a "contributing factor" in their preference to not unite directly with Sri Krsna? Remember, Krsna lila is set in Dvarapa Yuga when the rate of maturity was much faster than now in Kali-yuga. It appears that you are projecting your own experience onto Krsna lila.
During the first part of kaisora (vayah-sandhi) there is soft flesh and the breasts are not formed first. During navya the breasts begin to grow. The eyes are slightly restless, whereas during vayah-sandhi the eyes are not visibly restless. The smile does not come out of the mouth but lingers. During vayah-sandhi the smile is within the mouth. Full manifestation is slight. During vayah-sandhi the first symptoms of changes because of love are not visible whereas in navya they are visible.
As far as Krsna being 8 years old when performing the first rasa-dance in bhauma-lila, that would then make Radha around 7 years old and the manjaris mentioned above, around 5-6 years old. However, we do not base our understanding of these things based solely on bhauma-lila, but rather more so on aprakata-lila, the eternal unmanifest lila which is what the above ages are referring to (which all depends on first menstrutation).... Therefore, your point (Oh yeah) has validity, but it is not entirely relevant in terms of what I stated in my book. In my book I’m referring primarily to aprakata-lila (our desired ultimate destination) and thus, my statements are not entirely unreasonable."
BIF: In recent news posts on ISKCON Hare Krishna sites we have noted claims that devotees "protested" outside the Russian Embassy in Delhi re. the ISKCON temple demolition in Moscow. Our readers should be informed:- India's Prime Minister has returned from his Russian trip... the ISKCON temple demolition was NEVER on his AGENDA as claimed by cult propagandist liars. Furthermore, whereas dancing in front of an embassy may secure a few coin donations... "protesting" outside an embassy will certainly come under the "lathi maar" (beat with sticks) policy of Indian police....and would certainly attract media coverage. NO MEDIA covered the "protest" and no skulls were cracked. So it was just another ISKCON giant eagle egg. Protest in India requires permission. Demonstrations in front of Embassies or Consulates are a no no. No permission means confrontation with the law.... and the maha mantra doesn't cover broken bones or legal bills.
Until next time. Thank You for spending time with us.